Adam Rossen:
You need to go deep to get oil. But once you grow, why can't we have 50 different oil rigs all drilling deep in their own respective regions, or areas, or disciplines?
Chris Dreyer:
Let's face it, the personal injury landscape is more competitive than ever. You're up against aggressive advertising from big firms, ever-changing digital trends, and the constant pressure to stand out in the sea of attorneys all promising the same fee structure. Sound familiar? What if all the solutions you're looking for aren't within the PI world at all? That's why we're stepping outside our comfort zone and onto the world of criminal defense. Our guest today has faced similar challenges in his field and found innovative ways to overcome them. By looking beyond our usual horizons, we can gain fresh insights and new perspectives that can revolutionize how you approach your practice.
Welcome to Personal Injury Mastermind, the show where ambitious attorneys come to learn, implement, and get results. We break down the proven tactics to separate the best firms from the rest each week. I'm your host, Chris Dreyer, founder and CEO of Rankings.io. Today we're sitting down with Adam Rossen, a criminal defense attorney who's cracked the code on innovative marketing and firm growth strategies. From amassing over 1,000 five-star reviews to building a YouTube channel with millions of views, Adam's approach offers fresh perspectives that can revolutionize how you market your PI firm. In today's episode, we cover how to structure your org chart for accountability and transparency, how to build trust and gather powerful client reviews even in sensitive legal matters, and the secrets to creating video content that not only informs but converts viewers into clients. All right, let's get on with the show.
Adam Rossen:
My third year of law school at Miami, I was able to do a certified legal internship, a CLI, and I had five jury trials before I ever graduated law school, and absolutely loved it. I didn't know what I was going to do until I worked there my very last semester, and I was like, "Yes, I'm in the courtroom now. I get to have fun. This is amazing." I actually won one of the trials, so I was like, "All right, this is what it's meant to be," so I became a prosecutor. At the time I had certain goals. I wanted to get to homicide within 10 years. I wanted to be one of the best homicide prosecutors in South Florida, and I only ended up working there for about two years. So I ended up switching, but I really did enjoy my time. It was a lot of fun, and I learned a ton about being a lawyer and a trial lawyer.
Chris Dreyer:
You got it right in the ring right out of the gate, so you got some experience. Not a ton of people get that opportunity.
Adam Rossen:
I was doing real law stuff. I wasn't making money, but my friends who were making triple what I was making in big law, they were law clerks, they weren't real lawyers. So it just depends on what you want to do. The money wasn't there, but the experience was there, and it was really amazing.
Chris Dreyer:
You've been coaching high school basketball over 10 years. I coached basketball for about 5 years, now as a JV basketball coach, so I didn't get the top seat there. You had a story about securing a managing partner due to that experience, so I was just wondering if you could give me a little bit of background on the coaching and this partner.
Adam Rossen:
I'm 6'2", so I was a little too short, a little too slow to play higher level college. I was good at everything, not great at anything, and I was always coach on the floor. So I could have gone somewhere like DIII and chased the dream, but I really wanted to go to UF and be a kid and play, join a frat, play in the frat leagues, and just be a kid. So that was my choice. Then I went to Miami for law school, and I hated my first year of law school with a passion. I was so miserable. That summer I was like, "I need to do something 'cause I'm going crazy here. I'm just unhappy."
I ended up... For two years I was the head JV basketball coach, and my first year our team captain was Manny. It became a lifelong friendship. Actually, 20 years ago this year was when I was his coach and when I started coaching, and then he became my intern, he went to UF. We still are really good friends. He was a public defender. He left to do some civil work. He came back to be my associate, and now he's the managing partner and pretty much runs all of our lawyers and runs the operations of the firm. He is also the integrator, we run on ELS. So Manny and I are like brothers. It's just funny, I have so many different stories about how coaching basketball has been one of the best decisions I've ever made in my life. It's opened so many doors and I've learned and grown so much from it. It's incredible.
Chris Dreyer:
That's amazing. I know my experience was... Because I was kind of the same. I was one of the better players at our local school and got the DIII scholarships too. It was like I needed that competitive side. So coaching, I kind of got that through the players and just had a lot of fun with it.
Adam Rossen:
Yeah, and since I ended up... Those were my only years coaching JV, then I moved to varsity. But as an assistant, I couldn't be a head coach and run. Even back then when it was me and my old partner, and it was just the two of us, we didn't really have much of a firm. It was just two guys getting some cases occasionally and being good lawyers. I could do that. I don't coach high school now, because the commitment I just absolutely cannot do.
But I was fortunate enough, 10 years ago in 2014, won a state championship. I've coached some very talented players. I've coached against a few NBA players. So it's been one amazing journey. I still coach in the Maccabi games, which is the Jewish Olympics. Won a gold medal for the very first time. I think I've coached seven sets of games, finally won my first gold medal in Houston this year. We had an amazing team and it has been a great experience. But that for me is three, four weeks out of the year and a few weekends, so I can do it.
Chris Dreyer:
That's amazing. We'll have to chop it up more offline to talk about coaching. I want to jump ahead. You're across eight locations, you've completed over 2000 plus cases. I want to dig into some of the nuts and bolts of how you run your firm, 'cause you have an amazing practice, amazing firm.
Adam Rossen:
Thank you.
Chris Dreyer:
I think it's interesting to dive into team structure. So I was just wondering if you could just talk to us a little bit about team structure and your approach to the criminal defense practice.
Adam Rossen:
Sure, yeah. Keep in mind, we're always evolving. What we're doing today could easily be a complete 180 from what we're doing in two years or three years. We're always looking to kind of burn it down and rebuild as we grow, and not just for the purpose of doing that, but for what is best for the firm. But we grew quite a bit. We had six people right before... We had grown from about three and a half people in 2019 to six right before COVID, two lawyers, three legal assistants, three catch-all, do everything, and we had an internal marketing director. We exploded after COVID.
We had a nice little practice. We were probably top 10 in at least Fort Lauderdale, Broward County in size and cases, and we just had rocket ship kind of growth because of the decisions that we made during COVID, which we can talk about that a different day. But we hunkered down and we just worked really hard, and we grew from 6 to 13 employees in one year, and then from 13 to 20 in the next year. So we had massive growth. I've always been focused on the marketing 'cause that's exciting to me, but not so much of the system. So everything kind of broke.
Luckily we were on ELS, so we had our safe space to figure it all out, and talk and learn, and try to get better. But for where we are now, we have six attorneys, we have four and a half in production, Manny's maybe half in production. We have pods. We have virtual assistants. Maybe we're 13-ish people in-house and maybe 10 virtually, something around there where we have... Two and a half years ago when we really explored it, Manny and I debated for a long time, "Can we get virtual employees to be legal assistants, not just do a little intake or do some marketing or graphic design?" He was very against it at first, but we thought it through and talked it through from some of our mastermind groups and in ELS and ultimately said, "Let's do it. Let's try," and it's been one of the best decisions we've had.
So we have pods where two lawyers have one in-house legal assistant. We have a VLA1 that has a bunch of set of duties and a VLA2 that has a bunch of set duties, and that we believe can run about 150 to 180 cases, really 150 to 175 is kind of optimal, at a time. That's the way, currently, we're structuring our pods. Then we have our intake, obviously, team separate. Our legal assistants are always backup because sometimes when our phones are super hot, it's like, "All right, guys, we are segmented, but at the same time we're not. If the phone's ringing, just pick it up." But yeah, that's kind of the basic general way that we've done it.
Chris Dreyer:
I like digging into this conversation, the cross-functional pods versus the top-down teams. I think I first heard Mike Morse's book Fireproof, he was talking about how they went from a team top-down hierarchy to the pods. Have you seen... What's been the main benefit? Is it the communication? Is it the managing each P&L from a profit perspective?
Adam Rossen:
Well, we haven't even got that far with the P&L. We're still progressing forward with the finances. But yeah, that's on our goal, is to look at profitability by lawyer, by pod, and all that. It's been really good because in 2021 we hired three lawyers in eight months. We went from two lawyers, me and Manny, to five lawyers by August. At that time, the two lawyers that came on in January and then April, they're like, "Well, how do I know which cases are mine, and who do I go to? We just have three legal assistants. Do I have my own? Is it you?" And I'm like, "I don't know. We all just kind of do it all together and talk."
We used my case at the time, which was fine, but then we quickly outgrew it. And he's like, "Well, I kind of need to know, are these mine? Are these yours? How do we..." And we're like, "Okay, we actually need to have a real system instead of, Adam and Manny just divvy things up and talk about it every day," 'cause we share a wall together. So it really helped in that regard about having better clarity as far as who's doing, which legal assistants are working on what cases, who you can go to, looking at capacity analysis, skew analysis, all these different things.
We're still working on the financing, so that's something we're working on to really... Real data and metrics for profitability per employee, per pod, per lawyer. But, it's been really good overall. Then it's also good for the client, because for so long we have so many clients that were attached to me, and in a great way because we've always given Ritz-Carlton level customer service. But now you are still going to get that, but in the context of big firm strength and power, but you're still going to have that personal connection to your pod. It might not be with me directly anymore, but I want people to have that personal connection and be like, "Okay, my team is Augustina, Carlos, Gretchel, and Scott, and that's my pod and that's my team." That's really important to us.
Chris Dreyer:
There's a lot of ways of seeing different ways, different approaches. Thank you for sharing that.
Adam Rossen:
Well, Chris, I'll say one other thing too. What the PI lawyers do... Which we're always looking, and we're always trying to take from them. Some PI lawyers that I know, the case managers run the pods. So our in-house legal assistants, we're talking about rebranding them as case managers because that's kind of what they do. Because our VLAs talk to our clients as well, some of them can do anything that they can in-house except for notarize documents and just greet somebody in person.
But we're even toying with the idea of the two in-house legal assistants that we're going to brand that kind of run on each pod, putting them at the top of the pod on the accountability chart and saying, "Yeah, Gretchel and Niki run the pods. They're the case managers, they run the pods. Lawyers, you report to them." So we're toying with that. We haven't rolled that out, but that's my next iteration that we'll see if it works or not.
Chris Dreyer:
Yeah, I like that idea. You're like, "Hey, they own the communication, and the lawyers would work up the cases, so everyone has their responsibility." Just briefly on those virtual legal assistants, if you don't mind sharing, there's a couple organizations, is there a particular company that's helping you with that?
Adam Rossen:
We have a few different ones that we've tested. We have a few with Get Staffed Up. Get Staffed Up has been generally pretty good. We have a few with Virtual Latinos, and our ones with virtual Latinos have been pretty good. Not everybody's perfect, it is what it is. We've had a few direct hires that we've done as well. We'll go on... We use Wizehire just as the back end. They pump it out to Indeed, and LinkedIn, and all the different stuff. But I really like their back end.
If anybody uses DiSC, which we don't use DiSC anymore, but you get a free DiSC profile with it. So if you're paying $20, $30 per DiSC, it's free through Wizehire. Or should I say included in what you pay Wizehire, because nothing truly is free. It's been good. What we've done recently is, we've just set it to remote and we've set the country as Columbia. We've gotten a lot of great people from Columbia. We've looked into Argentina, Mexico. But really, we found a great sweet spot in Columbia. We've even had a few direct hires ourselves, so we're trying it all.
Chris Dreyer:
You talked about that Ritz-Carlton experience, that extreme white glove experience. You've got over 700 five-star reviews, and-
Adam Rossen:
We're actually pushing 1,000. Well-
Chris Dreyer:
Oh, wow.
Adam Rossen:
It's about 750 or so on Google, but between even the old ones we have on Avvo and everywhere else, I think we just probably broke 1,000.
Chris Dreyer:
That's incredible.
Adam Rossen:
I wish I could push them all to Google.
Chris Dreyer:
Well, I-
Adam Rossen:
Because the ones on Avvo are pretty worthless now.
Chris Dreyer:
Well, this is what I tell people. If Google, for organic SEO, is going to look at 200 ranking factors, they're going to count the other review sites and not just Google. So they're going to count Yelp, and BBB, and Avvo, and what have you. So I think it's good, actually. Of course, we want the Google first. But I have always heard this, and maybe I'm incorrect, but it just seems like criminal defense would be even harder to get reviews. It's like-
Adam Rossen:
That's what they say.
Chris Dreyer:
Right, 'cause do people want to talk about their DUI, or their drug offense, or what have you? So how would you counter that?
Adam Rossen:
Well, it's about building the trust and the relationship, so everything is about the trust and the relationship with our clients. Yeah, we have a lot of people that say, "Adam, I love you to death, but I'm not going on video for a video testimony." "Okay, no problem." I tell people, "Please tell me no." We have a lot of people that say, "Hey, look, I don't really want my name out there associated with it." And I say, "Well, look, you don't have to talk about the facts. You can just say we're great people. Or if you want to talk about your experience but not about the case, talk about how we made you feel. Talk about the relationship that we had, talk about when it was maybe a bad time for you personally, and how we helped you without saying, 'Yeah, Adam beat my domestic violence case, or my sex crime, or my DUI, or my whatever.'"
What I tell people is I say, "Look, you had nowhere to turn to. You had no referral. You didn't know where to go. You found us however you found us, maybe it was a referral, maybe it was online. At some point you read our reviews, and it gave you the courage to either call us or to know that we're the right ones for you. Imagine if you hired the wrong lawyer, or the wrong law firm. Imagine where you'd be today. So by doing this, it really helps us because we do 100% believe that we have a moral and ethical obligation to grow our firm to help more people, because we are a mission-based business, we do have very well-defined core values, and if we want to grow and help more people, you're helping us. I want you to think about the next person who would've been in your shoes, who God forbid they hired the wrong lawyer."
So a little bit of guilt in there, but really it's making them understand about how they can really truly pay it forward, and that they don't have to talk about the facts. They could talk that there was a bad situation, or they can say it was their family member or something, and just talk about how we helped in the emotional aspect of it. Generally, that helps people feel comfortable to write a review. We have some clients that are like, "Adam, I'll say it all, I'll do it all. I don't care. My life's out there anyway, and you guys are so amazing." But it all starts with the relationship. A lot of people, the old curmudgeons say I'm a great lawyer today when I get the case dismissed. And when I can't get the case dismissed tomorrow, I'm a terrible lawyer and they hate me. And I say, "That's just not true." It's not true. It's all about the relationship and how you make your clients feel, and that they trust that you and your team are doing everything for them. So it's not true.
Chris Dreyer:
I love every bit of that. I love that. Is there tech? Do you have your legal assistance asking? Is the attorney's asking? Tell me about just the overall emphasis of the reviews for the firm.
Adam Rossen:
Yeah, we do have a lot of tech. Just in general, we're very tech-focused and we're always getting better. We have our own custom Salesforce build. When we left my case, I was like, "I could go to the next software, that will be fine maybe until $10 mil in revenue. But I want the thing that I'll never grow out of. So let's just rip the bandaid off, pay a little more money now and have it." We're still getting better at that. Of course Salesforce is difficult, it's been a work in progress, but we're on the right track. It's a combination of things.
Automation's great. There's nothing worse than when automation goes wrong, and it's clear as day that this was not a genuine request or genuine conversation. Same thing with AI stuff. So in some of those instances, it would be better if you did nothing at all than to have the fancy automations, because then they actually detract or lower the customer experience. So we're very aware of that. Sometimes a lot of it's just good old-fashioned calling. We have one of our marketing VAs who maybe 10, 15% of her job is helping get reviews.
Our lawyers are very involved in getting reviews. Our intake team's very involved. We have contests, competitions. We tend to be competitive here, so we gamify it, especially the reviews because the reviews matter a lot. It's one of those things where, the week's over, we got 5 reviews, 10 reviews. I always say it's like Greek mythology, Sisyphus, who is the one who is rolling the big ball up the mountain and, at the end of the day, the ball rolls down and he has to do it again. I'm like, "That's Google reviews. That's it. It's every day. Last week is done. Short memory."
Chris Dreyer:
That's incredible. Yeah, it shows. Like you said, over 1,000 and more and more each week. I love the competition, the gamified method of doing that. Everybody wins, or you got a winner and a loser, and keeping it front and center.
Adam Rossen:
Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.
Chris Dreyer:
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So we got to talk about bringing in the cases. We talked about the team, we talked about client service. You've embraced omnichannel marketing. In fact, you attended PIMCon. You went, and you're learning what the personal injury attorneys are doing to market their practice. Can you walk us through just your overall thoughts on marketing, and just your mix of channels, and how you think about it?
Adam Rossen:
Yeah. I love marketing. So if I had to choose between marketing and finance or systems, I'm always going to skew to the marketing 'cause that's fun. I like being creative. We built the firm on the back of GBP and SEO, and more of the long-tail search, the real, "What do I do if I have a second DUI in Florida?," instead of more of the vanity searching. But that direct response is only going to get you so far. Now we also have grown quite a bit from YouTube. We have a really cool YouTube channel. We have over two and a half million views. We're doing a ton on there. That's been very successful as well.
Social, we have fun with, we use it more for the branding aspect. We want prosecutors, defense lawyers to see what we're doing. I think it actually helps with people wanting to work at our firm, which is great. We haven't gotten too many new cases from social, but we're exploring that. When LSAs came out, we jumped in hard, and then it got much more difficult and we pulled back, and now we're doing it again with you guys. So as we're growing, we always still need cases and direct response, but now we're really starting to explore the bigger level, the branding.
That's why I want to be around the fancy PI guys and see what they're doing, because also they tend to be ahead of the curve, the most creative, the ones that are embracing AI and different things. So really, for us, working with you guys and having our internal team as well, I think we can really hit a lot of things at once because we're at the point now where I want to open up all the other channels because... It's like drilling for oil. You need to go deep to get oil. But once you grow, why can't we have 50 different oil rigs all drilling deep in their own respective regions, or areas, or disciplines? That's what we're trying to do now. But really, initially we picked maybe three and we just dug deep in those three. So now we're trying to [inaudible 00:23:18].
Chris Dreyer:
I think in the professional services space, which is what we're in, I could go to a Cairo marketing convention, or a dental, which dental is super competitive, and be able to apply something I learned to my practice, your practice. I think that's a super smart approach to do. It also maybe gives you an opportunity to do something that other criminal defense attorneys aren't doing-
Adam Rossen:
Exactly.
Chris Dreyer:
Because they all kind of copy each other. I wanted to talk to two things here. First, let's dig into the YouTube channel, the amount of views that you're getting, the content's resonating with the audience. Let's talk about why you leaned into YouTube, and with that direction.
Adam Rossen:
Right. I always wanted to. So even since 2015, I wanted to, I just didn't have the time, didn't know how to do it. But during the pandemic we finally said, "You know what? We got nothing better to do, so we're going to do it." I'm friends with Robert Gouveia, who was a criminal defense attorney in Arizona doing really cool big things, especially on YouTube. Now he's pretty much not even with his firm anymore, and he's full-time hosting a political YouTube live show every day. It's like he's his own Fox News or CNN. Really cool stuff that he's doing.
But he had a little coaching group, and I know he was a bigger name in the criminal law space, very quickly and at a young age grew a multimillion dollar criminal practice. So I joined his group and we became buddies during the pandemic, and just started following some of his processes and procedures. We have two different types of video. We have a few different types, but really it's more of the low views, but we're doing a whole series on assault and battery, or on sex crimes, or on domestic violence, or DUI. We're going to get low to medium views, but we're going to have people go through deep dives and watch us and want to hire us from those videos.
It builds the know, like, and trust. It sees that we happen to be, I think, pretty cool nerdy lawyers, but we're still pretty cool. It makes the sales process easier. It has people find us more of the direct response style. And then we have the body camera videos where, with client permission, we post of the cops beating up our clients, or being caught in lies. Those are more the shock and awe, and those really help build the whole channel. We don't really make money off of those. I haven't wanted to monetize the channel because, just even from that, that's not our intention.
Maybe I'd set up a separate channel that would only be body camera videos, ours and other people's, where I'd analyze it. I haven't done that yet. But if I was, that's what I would do, and I would monetize that with the Google and YouTube ads. One brings in a lot of eyeballs and rises up, kind of tells YouTube that the channel is good and popular. And the other stuff is more of, you want information, it might be 3:00 in the morning and you can't sleep, watch our 10 videos or 15 videos on DUI that a bunch of our lawyers have shot, and we're getting cases, even federal cases from it. People want to hire us. So it's been very good.
Chris Dreyer:
That's awesome. That's amazing. Are you doing it all organic? Are you pumping a little bit of ads to some of the select videos?
Adam Rossen:
No, YouTube we're doing all organic. We're starting... It's funny, we've built the firm without much paid ads at all. LSA has been the only things. We never did PPC, we haven't done much paid social. Now we're starting to look into that from... Even retargeting we've never really done before. So again, we really truly mastered two to three disciplines very well, so now we're really starting to expand our marketing, and doing some more retargeting, doing some more ads, maybe some... I still would love to do some branding, even on YouTube, like the 6 second or 30 second unskippables, and those.
So there's a lot, that we've barely scratched the surface of what we can do and what we want to do. For us, we want to dominate. We want to absolutely own South Florida, and then decide from there if we're going to expand. So there's so much more that we can do, we just haven't had a really good digital partner and we haven't been able to have the internal team either. We've just had a lot of like... Look, we grew during the great resignation, and we grew so fast so quickly, so we've learned a lot about ourselves over the years that I feel like, where we're at now in 2024, we're really on the cusp of just blowing up what we want to do, and just totally double, tripling, quadrupling it.
Chris Dreyer:
Yeah, I couldn't agree more, and I see it. I see what you guys are doing. You're building the brand. You're hiring the right people. You've got the systems, and I don't see your guys' growth slowing down. I think the going deep on YouTube, and on the search engine marketing side, and what you guys are doing... You also have a podcast, you've got success in the South. How does this platform align with your target audience? What unique benefits do you see from podcasting?
Adam Rossen:
We have success in South Florida. I could do the Adam Lawyer Show, but there's so many people that do that and do it really well. So we really thought it through, and I wanted this as a relationship, community, and referral play. So that's how we do it. Which, of course you have some people say, "Well, Adam, what's the ROI on that?" And I go, "Well, I really don't know." But I think there's some things when you're talking about branding, and relationships, and referrals, it's more of a long play. You maybe can't give a direct ROI, but you can also see, are we getting more referral relationships? Are we strengthening our relationships? Because referrals are also a lot like dating. You may think somebody's referring you cases, but if you haven't talked to them or dated them in the last year, they got a new boyfriend, they got a new girlfriend.
Chris Dreyer:
So true,
Adam Rossen:
They got a new criminal defense lawyer or PI lawyer that they're sending cases to. It's just the way it is. I'm in different groups and organizations. I'm in Entrepreneurs' Organization, EO of South Florida. So when I meet somebody new it's, "Hey, you seem really cool. I'd love to learn more about you. By the way, I got a podcast. Come on my podcast, let me interview you." So it's also a way for me, who is a natural introvert, to force me to get out of my comfort zone to meet people, and then give them value where we say, "Yeah, we'll cut up the video. We'll give you clips for Instagram for all your stuff. Please promote it. Oh, by the way, we can even write up a press release. You want to put that on your website and give us a cool backlink?"
So there's so many different things, and I've been able to meet a lot of people. The first six months to a year, it was mostly people I already knew, so we could get content rolling. But already, it's forced me to meet new people, build new relationships, and do cool things, so I'm enjoying it a lot. From a pure ROI perspective, it hasn't been the most successful yet, but it's building and growing, and I see it, and it's just a great way for that... We wanted the local flavor, and we wanted really to create new relationships.
So I'll give you an example, Chris. We have a new friend who we met at PIMCon, Amanda Demanda. She's amazing. Her speech was amazing. She's an amazing human being. She's in South Florida now. There's a difference between Miami and Fort Lauderdale, so she is all Miami. But Laura and I, Laura is our chief revenue officer and marketing director, we were at PIMCon. We became very friendly with her. So of course, after talking to her for two, three days at PIMCon, I'm like, "I want to have you on our show, come up to our video studio."
And she goes, "Well, Adam, how about this? Do you want to do it in my video studio so you can see my firm and my ops?" And we were like, "Absolutely. We're going to take the show on the road." So next month, Laura and I are going to film in her studio, in her office. We're going to film my podcast, and we're going to spend the day, meet her team, and see how her ops work. She's a fast-growing PI firm, so I want to be around her and see all the cool things she's doing. We got a whole day that we're spending with her, so I'm so excited.
Chris Dreyer:
That is exactly... I loved hearing that. That makes me super happy, and I can't wait to tune into that episode. So that's going to be exciting to listen to. Adam, where can our audience go to connect with you, to check out your website, to get in touch?
Adam Rossen:
I think I'm easy to find. We do a lot on Facebook, LinkedIn, Instagram, the website, email. My email is adam@rossenlawfirm.com. I've had so many people that have helped me along the journey, and what I tell people is, "Never be afraid to reach out." I don't care what type of law, my new thing is... Well, it's not really new. But, I want to be the dumbest person in the room. I want to be the firm with the least amount of people, the smallest revenue around the big movers and shakers.
Look, I'll give you one more example from PIMCon, Chris. John Berry gave a fantastic speech to open, it was awesome. So Laura was talking to him there and she goes, "Hey, in the spring I want to come up to Nebraska and spend a day or two at your office." And he goes, "Sure. Goes get in touch with my people." So Laura and I, I think in February or March, we're going to Nebraska to spend a whole day at his office to see his three silos and how his ops work. One of his silos is criminal defense. What was the worst that can happen? He says no, he blows us off. Big deal.
So we're always willing to take those shots, and try, and to ask people that are doing amazing big things. So anybody that wants to get in touch with me, I'm easy to get in touch with. I absolutely love helping people. I learned so much from helping other people, and so many people have helped me along the way. So Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook. My email is adam@rossenlawfirm.com.
Chris Dreyer:
There were a ton of insights in today's episodes. Let's review the takeaways. It's time for the pinpoints. Pinpoint One, trust is everything, and nothing builds trust quite like positive reviews from real clients. Adam's firm has amassed over 1,000 five-star reviews across various platforms. It's an impressive feat, especially in the sensitive field of criminal defense. They've made gathering reviews a priority, turning it into a fun, competitive process for their team. But here's the key, to explain to clients how their testimonials can genuinely help others in similar situations. For personal injury firms, this approach can be a game changer.
Adam Rossen:
If you want to talk about your experience but not about the case, talk about how we made you feel. Talk about the relationship that we had. Talk about when it was maybe a bad time for you personally.
Chris Dreyer:
Pinpoint Two, if a picture is worth a thousand words, then video content is priceless. Adam's YouTube channel has over 2.5 million views, and it's bringing in cases. Create content that not only informs, but also resonates with your audience. Show your expertise, but also demonstrate your impact. Video content can significantly boost your firm's visibility, credibility, and ultimately your client acquisition. Remember, every view is a potential client, so get in front of as many eyes as you can.
Adam Rossen:
We're doing a whole series on assault and battery, or on sex crimes, or on domestic violence, or DUI. People go through deep dives and watch us, and it makes the sales process easier. We have the body camera videos where, with client permission, we post of the cops beating up our clients or being caught in lies. Those are more the shock and awe, and those really help build the whole channel.
Chris Dreyer:
Pinpoint Three, learn from other industries. Alexander Shunnarah looks to corporate America for inspiration. Adam Rossen, a criminal defense attorney, attends conferences like PIMCon, an event primarily for personal injury lawyers. Why? Because he understands that innovation often happens at the intersection of different fields. By stepping outside his comfort zone, Adam gains a fresh perspectives in cutting edge marketing strategies that he can adopt for his criminal defense practice. By broadening your horizons, you'll discover new ideas, novel approaches, and the innovative strategies that your competitors might miss.
Adam Rossen:
I want to be around the fancy PI guys and see what they're doing, because also they tend to be ahead of the curve, the most creative, the ones that are embracing AI and different things.
Chris Dreyer:
That wraps up this episode of PIM with Adam Rossen. You can learn more about him, grab his contact info and the resources mentioned today in the show notes. While you're there, pick up a copy of my new book, Personal Injury Lawyer Marketing: From Good to GOAT. If you like the book, head on over to Amazon and leave me a review. All right, everybody, thanks for hanging out. See you next time. I'm out.
